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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
A brief video was just posted to demonstrate Lucid's autonomous driving feature:

 

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Discussion Starter · #2 ·
Someone on another forum just pointed out this video is an excerpt of a longer video of a December 2016 test drive. My bad.
 

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A brief video was just posted to demonstrate Lucid's autonomous driving feature:

I believe LUCID does not use the terminology of "AUTOPILOT" but use "PILOT ASSIST".

I remember seeing this terminology a year or so ago. If I am wrong, please comment.
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 · (Edited)
In the article on its website, Lucid refers to their ADAS system as "DreamDrive". I've been unable to locate a reference to "Pilot Assist", but that doesn't mean they haven't used the term at some point. I've found their nomenclature to shift over time for some features.

I think Tesla's "Autopilot" and "Full Self Driving" monikers are deliberately misleading about their cars' capabilities. Lucid has made a wise choice in choosing a less descriptive term for the feature.

These days Tesla's Autopilot is nothing more than adaptive cruise control and lane keeping assist. They de-contented Autopilot by moving its few more advanced features over to the FSD package, perhaps hoping to induce more people to pay for a full self driving system that is nowhere being any such thing. Our new Model S Plaid has considerably less Autopilot capability than the 2015 Model S P90D we traded in for it.
 

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In the article on its website, Lucid refers to their ADAS system as "DreamDrive". I've been unable to locate a reference to "Pilot Assist", but that doesn't mean they haven't used the term at some point. I've found their nomenclature to shift over time for some features.

I think Tesla's "Autopilot" and "Full Self Driving" monikers are deliberately misleading about their cars' capabilities. Lucid has made a wise choice in choosing a less descriptive term for the feature.

These days Tesla's Autopilot is nothing more than adaptive cruise control and lane keeping assist. They de-contented Autopilot by moving its few more advanced features over to the FSD package, perhaps hoping to induce more people to paying for a full self driving system that is nowhere being any such thing. Our new Model S Plaid has considerably less Autopilot capability than the 2015 Model S P90D we traded in for it.
You know how ELON is. A lot of talk for promotion and less in action and delivery.

No one has said this. My personal opinion is that Peter may have left Tesla for releasing Model S before it's time. My Tesla S is made so poorly I can move the front fender 1-2 inches back and forth at the back joint at hood.

Since Peter is very cautious and releases information on Lucid which is lot less than its capability. Also wants to make sure Tesla disaster dent happen to Lucid. I believe strongly in his belief. Did you get a chance to attend February 13 2020 get together at Newark, CA on their first event on Dream Edition. Peter was mingling with everyone and he a very polite but serious gentleman to listen to what he was saying. He is a solid leader and I am very sure Lucid Motor not only survives but will be a shining star in EV industry. Money is less important than the quality and efficiency.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
It's hard to know what the real story is at Tesla. It could well be that Musk forced an early release of the Model S. There have been reports that Rawlinson simply had all he could take of Musk and joined the legions of Tesla execs who have left the company. I once did an off-the-cuff analysis of who had left Tesla. Inside the generally high attrition rate, what stood out particularly was the extremely high turnover in the compliance functions of Finance and Legal. This can be a sign that people who are responsible for legal compliance and clean financial reporting were put under unusually intense pressure at Tesla. Given Musk's open flouting of SEC rules and settlement agreements and dodgy sales timing practices, this theory seems supportable.

It's telling that 8 of the 20 senior staff at Lucid came from Tesla, including the head of manufacturing (Peter Hochholdinger) and the head of hardware engineering (Erich Bach). In the engineering world, people seek to work for people whose engineering chops they trust more than any other factor. And Rawlinson seems to be a talent magnet for engineers where Musk is a talent repellant.

One has to remember that Rawlinson is a mechanical engineer who added electrical engineering to his resume later in his career. He is not a manufacturing engineer, and prior to Lucid he has never overseen a manufacturing function. Thus he brought in a well-known industry player for that role at Lucid.

We took delivery on August 21 of a Tesla Model S Plaid. Despite a lot of hoopla about its much-improved build quality, we are finding more uneven panel gaps and interior trim misalignments than in our 2015 Model S. The car has already been in the shop to correct the scuffing of the yoke against the steering column, and mobile repair is coming tomorrow to replace the driver side outside mirror which vibrates so badly that images don't resolve clearly. We've just been hoping it doesn't fly off the car before it can be replaced. On the other hand, our 2015 Tesla had some hidden flaws. A battery pack weld failure took out the battery pack and the rear drive unit, we went through four driver door handle mechanisms, and the MCU had to be replaced. In fact, we were in such a hurry to replace the car after its extended warranty expired that we took a Model S Plaid instead of waiting for the Rivian R1S Launch Edition we had reserved to replace the S.

Tesla has taken a lot of justified flak over shoddy build quality and poor inspection. However, the Model S electric powertrain rocked the automotive world, and THAT is what was squarely in Peter Rawlinson's brief.
 

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Agree with you 100%

Tesla is building so many Giga manufacturing units.

In five years, they may end up manufacturing other brand EV's along with their own Tesla.

or if they don't improve the quality, they may even go down in their fortune.
 

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It's hard to know what the real story is at Tesla. It could well be that Musk forced an early release of the Model S. There have been reports that Rawlinson simply had all he could take of Musk and joined the legions of Tesla execs who have left the company. I once did an off-the-cuff analysis of who had left Tesla. Inside the generally high attrition rate, what stood out particularly was the extremely high turnover in the compliance functions of Finance and Legal. This can be a sign that people who are responsible for legal compliance and clean financial reporting were put under unusually intense pressure at Tesla. Given Musk's open flouting of SEC rules and settlement agreements and dodgy sales timing practices, this theory seems supportable.

It's telling that 8 of the 20 senior staff at Lucid came from Tesla, including the head of manufacturing (Peter Hochholdinger) and the head of hardware engineering (Erich Bach). In the engineering world, people seek to work for people whose engineering chops they trust more than any other factor. And Rawlinson seems to be a talent magnet for engineers where Musk is a talent repellant.

One has to remember that Rawlinson is a mechanical engineer who added electrical engineering to his resume later in his career. He is not a manufacturing engineer, and prior to Lucid he has never overseen a manufacturing function. Thus he brought in a well-known industry player for that role at Lucid.

We took delivery on August 21 of a Tesla Model S Plaid. Despite a lot of hoopla about its much-improved build quality, we are finding more uneven panel gaps and interior trim misalignments than in our 2015 Model S. The car has already been in the shop to correct the scuffing of the yoke against the steering column, and mobile repair is coming tomorrow to replace the driver side outside mirror which vibrates so badly that images don't resolve clearly. We've just been hoping it doesn't fly off the car before it can be replaced. On the other hand, our 2015 Tesla had some hidden flaws. A battery pack weld failure took out the battery pack and the rear drive unit, we went through four driver door handle mechanisms, and the MCU had to be replaced. In fact, we were in such a hurry to replace the car after its extended warranty expired that we took a Model S Plaid instead of waiting for the Rivian R1S Launch Edition we had reserved to replace the S.

Tesla has taken a lot of justified flak over shoddy build quality and poor inspection. However, the Model S electric powertrain rocked the automotive world, and THAT is what was squarely in Peter Rawlinson's brief.
Agree with you 100%

Tesla is building so many Giga manufacturing units.

In five years, they may end up manufacturing other brand EV's along with their own Tesla.

or if they don't improve the quality, they may even go down in their fortune.
I agree as well. I am "OK" on the styling, but the misaligned panels and other poor workmanship is the main reason I don't have a Tesla. Competition from Lucid, Rivian and other EV makers will put a dent in Tesla. I have compared Tesla to Sony to many people I talk to. Sony had much better tech, Betamax, Walkman etc. but due to popularity and lower cost VHS won out. Sony is STILL around, Tesla is going nowhere, but they will not be selling the lion share of cars if they don't get the quality under control. The $20,000 Tesla EV is going to have better panel alignment and quality control with much higher volumes???
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
I would add something else about Rawlinson. Musk falsely claimed that Rawlinson was only involved in the chassis and suspension engineering of the Model S. (That lie has been debunked by, among other things, Tesla's own press release at the time Rawlinson joined Tesla.) However, it's clear that the Model S suspension was in Rawlinson's larger Chief Engineer brief at Tesla.

Shortly after the Model S was released a Tesla suspension was torn down by a shop that engineers and builds racing suspensions. They were shocked by how sophisticated the suspension was for a newly-introduced passenger vehicle, comparing it to the best they had seen from Mercedes in both design and execution. Jaguar might not have been known for the best build quality, but it has been famous for its compliant and precise suspensions for decades. And Lotus is even more storied for its suspension and handling chops. Rawlinson was the Lead Engineer at Jaguar and the head of Advanced Engineering at Lotus. I suspect this man knows more about suspension engineering than almost anyone in the industry.

When Lucid dropped its plans for an air suspension because of issues with the vendor, it brought the suspension engineering of the Air in house and switched to the coil spring / semi-active damper design. This alarmed me at first. But then I considered that this was the same suspension set up in my superbly precise and compliant Audi R8's, although Audi was using air suspensions in its lesser models. I think the success of this switch was borne out by Jonny Lieberman's take on the car's handling in his recent "Motor Trend" review.
 

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Wasn't the GT-R renown for being a little harsh a ride, especially the Nismo versions? Most of the reviews seem to indicate that not to be the case with Lucid.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
It's a little hard to compare reports of the Lucid ride from one reviewer to another, as the suspension setup seems to be undergoing more late-stage rejiggering than other mechanical systems on the car, and almost every reviewer has been in a car with a different setup.

Jonny Lieberman at "Motor Trend" did compare it to a "luxury" GT-R (whatever that is) but said it rides "rather well in Smooth mode." Even as the most recent reviewer, however, he was in a car awaiting recalibration of the front end sway control and damping.

Kyle Conner of "InsideEVs" commented that the ride was very compliant and felt well-planted.

Nikki Gordon-Bloomfield of "Transport Evolved" found the ride very compliant and controlled, both on the highway and, in a letter test ride, through the mountain twisties outside of Los Angeles.

Kristen Lee of "The Drive" rode in the Air on the cobblestone streets of the NYC Meat Packing District and the sometimes dodgy West Side Highway and found the ride extremely comfortable.

I have seen no one report on the ride in negative terms.
 
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